2005-2009 President

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Lounge' started by socalguy, Sep 5, 2004.

  1. t_roy

    t_roy Well-Known Member

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    Do you think CLINTON did? Oh my gosh part of the reason for this conflict in IRAQ is because Clinton turned his back on that situation. He did his little pomp and circumstance regarding Iraq and terriorists, but overall he did nothing except reduce our military and military spending. Like or not we are the World Police, and everyone looks to us to continue to be the "Bad Guys". I am sorry but I don't believe Kerry will do the same thing.
     
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  2. t_roy

    t_roy Well-Known Member

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    BRING IT ON, JOHN
    Oliver North (archive)
    August 27, 2004

    "Of course, the president keeps telling people he would never question my
    service to our country. Instead, he watches as a Republican-funded attack
    group does just that. Well, if he wants to have a debate about our service
    in Vietnam, here is my answer: 'Bring it on.'" -- Sen. John Kerry


    Dear John,

    As usual, you have it wrong. You don't have a beef with President George
    Bush about your war record. He's been exceedingly generous about your
    military service. Your complaint is with the 2.5 million of us who served
    honorably in a war that ended 29 years ago and which you, not the
    president, made the centerpiece of this campaign.

    I talk to a lot of vets, John, and this really isn't about your medals or
    how you got them. Like you, I have a Silver Star and a Bronze Star. I only
    have two Purple Hearts, though. I turned down the others so that I could
    stay with the Marines in my rifle platoon. But I think you might agree with
    me, though I've never heard you say it, that the officers always got more
    medals than they earned and the youngsters we led never got as many medals
    as they deserved.

    This really isn't about how early you came home from that war, either,
    John. There have always been guys in every war who want to go home. There
    are also lots of guys, like those in my rifle platoon in Vietnam, who did a
    full 13 months in the field. And there are, thankfully, lots of young
    Americans today in Iraq and Afghanistan who volunteered to return to war
    because, as one of them told me in Ramadi a few weeks ago, "the job isn't
    finished."

    Nor is this about whether you were in Cambodia on Christmas Eve, 1968.
    Heck John, people get lost going on vacation. If you got lost, just say so.
    Your campaign has admitted that you now know that you really weren't in
    Cambodia that night and that Richard Nixon wasn't really president when you
    thought he was. Now would be a good time to explain to us how you could
    have all that bogus stuff "seared" into your memory -- especially since you
    want to have your finger on our nation's nuclear trigger.

    But that's not really the problem, either. The trouble you're having,
    John, isn't about your medals or coming home early or getting lost -- or
    even Richard Nixon. The issue is what you did to us when you came home,
    John.

    When you got home, you co-founded Vietnam Veterans Against the War and
    wrote "The New Soldier," which denounced those of us who served -- and were
    still serving -- on the bat! tlefields of a thankless war. Worst of all,
    John, you then accused me -- and all of us who served in Vietnam -- of
    committing terrible crimes and atrocities.

    On April 22, 1971, under oath, you told the Senate Foreign Relations
    Committee that you had knowledge that American troops "had personally
    raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to
    human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies,
    randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of
    Genghis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and
    generally ravaged the country side of South Vietnam." And you admitted on
    television that "yes, yes, I committed the same kind of atrocities as
    thousands of other soldiers have committed."

    And for good measure you stated, "(America is) more guilty than any other
    body, of violations of (the) Geneva Conventions . the torture of
    prisoners, the killing of prisoners."

    Your "antiwar" statements and activities were painful for those of us
    carrying the scars of Vietnam and trying to move on with our lives. And for
    those who were still there, it was even more hurtful. But those who
    suffered the most from what you said and did were the hundreds of American
    prisoners of war being held by Hanoi. Here's what some of them endured
    because of you, John:

    Capt. James Warner had already spent four years in Vietnamese custody when
    he was handed a copy of your testimony by his captors. Warner says that for
    his captors, your statements "were proof I deserved to be punished." He
    wasn't released until March 14, 1973.

    Maj. Kenneth Cordier, an Air Force pilot who was in Vietnamese custody for
    2,284 days, says his captors "repeated incessantly" your one-liner about
    being "the last man to die" for a lost cause. Cordier was released March 4,
    1973.

    Navy Lt. Paul Gala! nti says your accusations "were as demoralizing as
    solitary (confinement) ... and a prime reason the war dragged on." He
    remained in North Vietnamese hands until February 12, 1973.

    John, did you think they would forget? When Tim Russert asked about your
    claim that you and others in Vietnam committed "atrocities," instead of
    standing by your sworn testimony, you confessed that your words "were a bit
    over the top." Does that mean you lied under oath? Or does it mean you are
    a war criminal? You can't have this one both ways, John. Either way, you're
    not fit to be a prison guard at Abu Ghraib, much less commander in chief.

    One last thing, John. In 1988, Jane Fonda said: "I would like to say
    something ... to men who were in Vietnam, who I hurt, or whose pain I
    caused to deepen because of things that I said or did. I was trying to help
    end the killing and the war, but there were times when I was thoughtless
    and careless about it a! nd I'm ... very sorry that I hurt them. And I want
    to apologize to them and their families."

    Even Jane Fonda apologized. Will you, John?

    Ollie North


    I am sorry but Kerry is not the man I want leading this country.
     
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  3. Tris10

    Tris10 Site Founder

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    You under estamate Clinton and everything he's done to make America as strong as it was.

    Iraq had no terriorists or ties to them, Don't let Bush's "comments" cloud ones judgement

    And what was he to do? Invaid Iraq? It was the wrong move now so how would it be a good move in the 90's ? IF anything Bush's father should have finished Saddam off.
     
  4. socalguy

    socalguy Well-Known Member

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    He had an agreement w/ Saddam to pull out, but he didn't, therefore breaking the agreement. Obviously everybody knew that one.

    I am not republican, nor democratic, and can't vote, and don't really want to.

    When I turn 18, I am not going to register to vote, as I don't want to go to jury duty. No possible law going by will make me want to register to vote...unless some idiot is trying to make it 30 at which age you can drink, or make it 18, then I will have to switch over. Ohh yeah, or if somebody wants to turn America into Netherlands where you can buy the Green Grass at the cafes like I did when I was there in the summer :p
     
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  5. Golden Gophers

    Golden Gophers Well-Known Member

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    Actually there were plenty of opportunities to do it in the 90s and it is not a bad move. Clinton actually had plans for an attack on Iraq, but never followed through. Kerry can't make his god damn mind up on whether he is for or against a war. He wants to appease everyone, and we know what happened last time some world leaders appeased another one, WWII.
     
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  6. XBoxJon

    XBoxJon Well-Known Member

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    That won't save you from jury duty.

    Jury duty isn't that big of a deal anyway, it's very easy to get out of.... I've done that 3x already.
     
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  7. Tris10

    Tris10 Site Founder

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    if clinton attacked Iraq it would have been even worse then when Bush did it. But then again at least he wouldn't have tried to string 9/11 to it, and use the fears of the people.

    I think everyone fails to realize Iraq was a mistake. Fine an evil dictator is gone but what about Iran, what about North Korea, what about Sudan ?
     
  8. The Original MP

    The Original MP Wreck 'Em Tech

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    Well we can't get rid of them all at once. :laugh:
     
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  9. Tris10

    Tris10 Site Founder

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    I don't think you want to touch North Korea. The whole "communist" thing , plus it's a poor starving country with no resources
     
  10. Golden Gophers

    Golden Gophers Well-Known Member

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    Actually you can't just take everyone out at one time, in due time they will be gone when the time is better. It seems like you think that the US just has the capability to go into any country at any time and remove any form of government without any friction. The US saw an opportunity to take out Saddam and did. Tough decisions were made on whether or not to go into Iraq whether you want to realize it or not. I am sick of hearing that all these other bad leaders are around, cuz Canada is full of a bunch of horse riding panzies that just sit around and watch the US do good in the world, and then when a decision has some friction you criticize, the world could use a lot less critics and we would be a lot more productive. When Canada starts policing the world and taking a prominent stand in World politics then get back to me Tris. But when all you government does is sits on it hands, there is not much room to complain.
     
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  11. t_roy

    t_roy Well-Known Member

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    This is what is wrong with America and this is what our future looks like...........Very sad.......:cry: I don't care WHO or WHAT you vote for but get out and vote when you turn 18. Just because you don't register for the draft and BTW against the law not too. It is part of being an adult. You need to understand that you have responsibilities, like them or not.

    When I turn 18, I am not going to register to vote, as I don't want to go to jury duty. No possible law going by will make me want to register to vote...unless some idiot is trying to make it 30 at which age you can drink, or make it 18, then I will have to switch over. Ohh yeah, or if somebody wants to turn America into Netherlands where you can buy the Green Grass at the cafes like I did when I was there in the summer
     
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  12. socalguy

    socalguy Well-Known Member

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    Don't you have to be a citizen to register? I have only lived in US for 3 whole years, isn't there like 10 year minimum?
     
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  13. t_roy

    t_roy Well-Known Member

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    Tris I agree with you that HE (Clinton) did some outstanding things during his term. In fact I believe his strength was our economy, however his huge weakness was international and military and it shows and we as a country are paying for his sins. Not to mention he set the womens movment back about 15 years due to his childish behavior and his atitiude that Whereever and whenever he can get some he is going to do it. He was the President for gods sake not some Fraternity boy. He was a total embarassment for this country. Period.

    I will also have to say that if everyone understood the ins and outs of policy and knowledge of each candidates platforms as much as you do then this country including myself would be better person for it. You don't even get to vote and you know more then 80% of population.

    Kudos to you.
     
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  14. Marauders

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    I would love to hear what was so fabulous that Clinton did. Someone needs to fill me in. Yes, that is for Tris who made that statement.

    You guys forget that Reagan had a 16 year plan for the economy back when he was president. It went through 8 years of Reagan, then 4 years of Bush Sr. Then Clinton got in office. Clinton reaped the benifits of the economy during his first and most of his second term. He then killed the economy. You need to look back for when the economy started its decline. It was in October, when Clinton was still in office before the last presidential change. Bush inherited the economy that Clinton gave us.
     
  15. Marauders

    Marauders Guest

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    You know, you only have to have a drivers license now to be called into jury duty. You no longer have to be registered to vote. You do have to be a citizen of the US and you can not have a felony record, but being a registered voter is no longer a criteria. Found that out the last time I went to jury duty.
     
  16. Marauders

    Marauders Guest

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    Well, Clinton tried to take out Osama Bin Laden and we all know how well that did.
     
  17. The Original MP

    The Original MP Wreck 'Em Tech

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    So socal, what Marauders is saying is if you want to get out of jury duty just commit some sort of felony. :laugh:
     
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  18. Marauders

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    You got that right. Every decision that Kerry makes will be long after the subject comes up. Kerry wants to see the results of the public opinion poll before he does anything. What we will end up with is the country being run by the media if Kerry gets in office.
     
  19. The Original MP

    The Original MP Wreck 'Em Tech

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    [​IMG]
     
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  20. The Original MP

    The Original MP Wreck 'Em Tech

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    Us Texans would definitely have to vote Bush after seeing that picture.
     
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